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HomeMy WebLinkAbout08 29 1995 PC Minutes8-29-95 AUGUST 29, 1995 The Albemarle County Planning Commission held a public hearing on Tuesday, August 29, 1995, Room 7, County Office Building, Charlottesville, Virginia. Those members present were: Ms. Babs Huckle; Mr. Tom Blue, Chair; Mr. Bill Nitchmann; Ms. Katherine Imhoff, Vice Chair; Mr. Bruce Dotson; and Ms. Monica Vaughan. Other officials present were: Mr. Wayne Cilimberg, Director of Planning & Community Development; Mr. David Benish, Chief of Community Development; Ms. MaryJoy Scala, Senior Planner; Ms. Amelia McCulley, Zoning Administrator; Mr. Greg Kamptner, Assistant County Attorney; and Mr. Pete Anderson, UVA Representative. Absent: Commissioner Jenkins. The meeting was called to order at 7:00 p.m. and a quorum was established. The minutes of August 15, 1995 were approved (4:0:2) as amended. Commissioners Imhoff and Nitchmann abstained from action on the minutes because they had been absent from the August 15th meeting. CONSENT AGENDA *Akmw► Milton T., Jr. and Patricia J. Edgerton - Request for waiver of Section 18-36(f) of the Subdivision Ordinance to allow two entrances to be maintained onto Route 676. MOTION: Ms. Imhoff moved, seconded by Mr. Dotson, that the Consent Agenda be approved. The motion passed unanimously. ZTA-95-03 Farm Sales - Proposal to amend Section 10.0, Rural Areas District, RA, of the Zoning Ordinance, to permit by special use permit the sale of merchandise not necessarily produced on the premises, but directly related and accessory to agricultural or horticultural produce which is grown by the owner or his family on their farm. Deferred from August 15, 1995 Planning Commission Meeting. Ms. Scala presented the staff report. The staff report, and staffs oral presentation, explained changes made to the proposed amendment to address concerns expressed by the Commission at the August 15th meeting. Referring to ARB approval, Mr. Blue asked: "What if they are converting an existing building that was originally exempt?" Staff response: "That would still require a building permit. Chances are they would be making some revisions. A building permit or a site plan is required." 7O&A on 8-29-95 2 Mr. Dotson asked the County to describe a revocation proceeding. Mr. Kamptner responded: "Generally, when a permit is issued, the permitee is required to comply with certain conditions. If it is believed they are not in compliance a hearing is conducted and if they are found not to be in compliance, the permit can be revoked." Ms. McCulley said this happens very rarely. She could recall only one instance of a revocation. She explained: "Basically, it is flagrant, willful, non-compliance, where repeated attempts at compliance have not been successful. The person is notified that if they don't comply, there will be a hearing and at that point they could have the permit revoked. If they continue the activity, further action would be taken, including an injunction, or some other legal action." Ms. McCulley explained the inspection process. She said there will be an initial inspection before issuance of the zoning clearance. Thereafter inspections would occur in response to public complaints, or if there is a bond to be released. She was uncertain as to how measurements and calculations of the percentages would be made. She said she would need to check with her inspectors before answering. She doubted that measurements would actually be made with a ruler "unless the area was very visibly out of sorts." She confirmed that she favored limitation to one building. She felt multiple buildings would compound enforcement problems. Public comment was invited. Mr. Scott Peyton addressed the Commission. He quoted from the Comp Plan: "For agricultural and forestal resources to be successfully preserved from a land use standpoint, they must be successful as a businesslindustry. " He said what he proposes is indeed a commercial operation, as it must be if he is to be successful as a farm. He expressed the following specific concerns about the proposed amendment: --He thought the 1,500 square foot limitation was much too small. He asked that 2,000 square feet be considered, which he felt was a fairer compromise. --He asked the percentages be put back at what was originally proposed, i.e. 50/50, and that it be "considered over the entire growing season, rather than at every point in time." He explained that he hoped "to extend his seasons to the more marginal seasons --spring and late fall." He said it would be very difficult, if not impossible, to meet the 75% ceiling at all times. --He was very concerned about the restriction against greenhouses being open to the public. He explained that his pick -your -own fields (strawberries and pumpkins) are production areas, as is his greenhouse. He said: "My request to you is to not exclude that from being open to the public, that once that crop, as it were, is ready to harvest, that my customers can, in fact, walk to the greenhouse, pick out a flat of plants, bring it to my wayside stand, and purchase it." He gave as an example a poinsettia crop which is grown in the greenhouse. If those plants had to be transported to an unheated farm sales structure, they would not survive. 4. st 8-29-95 --He asked that the term "produced on the farm" contained in the definition, be changed to read "produced and/or grown on the farm." Ms. Babette Thorpe, representing the Piedmont Environmental Council, addressed the Commission. She read a statement (Attachment A to these minutes) which expressed support for all three amendments before the Commission (Farm Sales, Farmers' Market, and Commercial Stables). Additionally, she expressed support for Mr. Peyton's request that greenhouses not be excluded from the public. There being no further public comment, the matter was placed before the Commission. Mr. Dotson said he thought the proposal for 2,000 square feet was reasonable. He noted that it was half of what was originally proposed. He said he found it reassuring that the square footage could be waived during the special permit process. Ms. Imhoff said she was comfortable with the 1,500 square feet because it "ties in with what we've done with wayside stands and if more than 1,500 is needed a waiver can be requested." As a compromise, she said she would favor remaining at 1,500 square feet, but allow the mix of products to be changed to 50/50, and allow the greenhouses to be considered part of the production area not to be counted in the square footage. She said she was a little concerned about whether the 50/50 is over the course of a growing season, because she thought it would be impossible to enforce. Mr. Dotson said he could support Ms. Imhoffs suggested compromise. He expressed some concern about the wording which would allow the greenhouses to be considered as production areas. He said: "I wouldn't want someone to say, 'this has been built as a greenhouse (so) now I can use it as part of my sales area,' because it appears to be a greenhouse --it's a glass structure, etc." He thought it should be very clear that it is intended that it be greenhouses that are actually greenhouses. He also thought there should be some allowance for part of the greenhouse to be used as the retail sales area, with the rest used for raising plants. He thought this should be worded carefully. There was a discussion of the interpretation of the floor area percentages. Mr. Dotson said he understood it to mean: "If we want 50%, any time you walk in, up to half the floor area could be in merchandise not grown or produced on the farm, and there might not be one single thing else in the rest of the building --it might be empty, or it might have one bin of corn in it, or it could be full. But what we're saying is half that floor area is for these other items." Ms. Imhoff said she hoped it meant: "The building is full and 50% of those things are grown or produced on the farm. I have not been so caught up with floor area. I understand it to mean, within the structure, 50% of what is being sold can be companion items." Mr. Blue felt this would be difficult to enforce because it would be difficult to measure. Mr. Blue agreed with Mr. Dotson's interpretation, i.e. ,,. "50% could be items from Hong Kong and the rest could be empty." Ms. Huckle said "44 8-29-95 4 she did not interpret it that way. Referring to item 4 in the staff report, Ms. Huckle pointed out that it says: "The requirement for agricultural or horticultural produce or merchandise produced on the premises should be a certain percentage of the indoor area at all times." Ms. Scala said staff had attempted to address this concern by adding the phrase at all times. Ms. Scala explained: "So the way this is worded, at all times, at least 75% of the retail sales area inside the farm sales structure shall be agricultural or horticultural produce or merchandise produced on the premises. At any time you would have at least 75% of it agricultural and then the remaining 25% would be companion items. That is how we tried to address your concern. If you want it to be like Mr. Peyton wants it, then we'll have to re -word that." Mr. Dotson said: "So the way it is written here, this says that it has to be essentially full at all times in order to have the maximum proportion of off -premises merchandise." Ms. Huckle addressed Mr. Dotson's comment: "Otherwise, it would just be any other retail commercial store." Slightly later in the meeting, Mr. Cilimberg addressed this percentage question further. (See below.) Mr. Blue said the Commission could get caught up in the technical details of the amendment, whereas he thought the discussion should be about the principle of the amendment. He said: "If we are going to consider agricultural industries in keeping farming as something that is not only good for the farmer, but good for the community and the whole county, and the only way the farmer can do that is to be able to sell these items plus some companion items --if we adhere to that principle, then I don't think there is much reason to nit-pick this because I can't see it being economically viable for a Wal-mart or something similar to produce 25% or 50% of what they sell and make money on the rest. I don't think that's going to happen. On the other hand, if our principle is that we don't want any commercial sales in the agricultural areas, then we ought not to allow anything other than agricultural produce to be sold. It seems to me the purpose of this ZTA, as it was originally proposed, was to give farmers an economic advantage so that they could keep their farms. If we agree with that principle, then I don't see that these percentages and that sort of thing are too important." Ms. Imhoff disagreed with Mr. Blue. She said: "It's nice some things are black and white, but I think a lot of things are thresholds. Since I was the person who expressed a lot of concern of not competing with people who buy commercially zoned property and subsequently pay taxes for commercially zoned property, I feel the staff has done a good job of hitting a threshold that makes me comfortable that this is supportive of agriculture while not being competitive with commercial property. And the size of the structure and the mix of the product is important. It is not nit-picking in my mind. For me to be able to vote comfortably on this text amendment, I need to see it stay at 1,500 square feet, go to a 50-50 mix, and add language that the greenhouses will not count as part of the floor area." En 8-29-95 5 Mr. Blue responded: "Suppose it were possible for a farmer to prove to you that if he didn't have at least 50% (of companion items), he couldn't sell enough items to be able to keep himself in business, and to be competitive with people in the business. (So) he's going to have to sell his farm for residential purposes. Would you still feel that way? That's my point. It just boils down to a simple issue to me --are we going to try to help the farmers by letting them have a commercial advantage in their rural area district, or are we not willing to do that because we think it ought to be strictly agriculture?" Ms. Imhoff thought that most Commissioners appear to be supportive of giving the farmer this option for the farm sales, but not carte blanc. She pointed out that the fact that the Commission can waiver supplementary regulations makes this even more flexible. Mr. Cilimberg returned to the earlier topic of the interpretation of the mix of products. He said: "I believe what Mr. Dotson said is correct. The way I read the language, we are talking about percentage of the retail sales area in the farm sales structure which at all times must be devoted to agricultural and horticultural produce or merchandise produced on the premises. It's not a percentage of what you have in there; it's a percentage of the area. I just want to make sure that Ms. McCulley understood it the same way because she is the one that is going to be enforcing that. If you decided at a particular point in time that you want, in the 50% of that area that is devoted to the outside products, that you want to load up, but in the other 50% of the area you don't have anything to sell, it still meets the requirement of this supplementary regulation." He asked Ms. McCulley if he was correct. (Ms. McCulley indicated he was correct by a nod of her head.) Mr. Dotson clarified: "The way I was interpreting at all times is a person couldn't say today it is 75% of the area and tomorrow it is 25%, so that averages to 50%. This would say 'at no point could it exceed 50%, or whatever the number was."' Mr. Cilimberg responded: "Exactly." Ms. Huckle added: "There are times, maybe, if you are more successful with your selling manufactured items then you wouldn't have to sell any produce at all, as long as you had your square footage set aside for pumpkins, or something, and the other square footage set aside for flower pots. You would be adhering to the regulation." Mr. Dotson thought the last sentence in section (a) --The farm sale structure shall not be established until the agricultural or horticultural produce growing area has been established and is in production. -- addresses this question. He said: "You have to be bone fide --you may not have harvested yet, but it's got to be under way and will be filling up inside the sales area." Mr. Dotson asked: "Is that the intent? Does that seem workable?" Ms. Scala responded: "Yes. Definitely. The problem is in months such as March, when produce is not yet coming in. But we definitely anticipated that he would have things growing and in production before he establishes the structure. Otherwise, what would be the purpose of it?" Mr. Dotson asked it that would be true each year, i.e. "The first year it is active and thriving but after that, for some reason...." Ms. Huckle finished Mr. Dotson's nwl 8-29-95 6 sentence: "...it was easier to unpack the boxes than to plant the plants." Mr. Dotson said: "I assume this would be annually true." Mr. Cilimberg said: "This has to do with establishing the farm sales structure itself. So, if you build the structure and establish it for that use, and then you go out of production ... (sentence unfinished)." Mr. Dotson asked: "Can this be written to say 'initially and each year'?" Ms. Scala responded: "That was the intent." Ms. Huckle pointed out that there seem to be several interpretations of the intent. Ms. Imhoff concluded: "I think this is one of those areas where we are just going to have to see how it goes and if someone really abuses it that is when you appeal the special permit." Ms. Imhoff asked if Mr. Dotson had some language in mind which would clarify the intent. Mr. Dotson suggested adding to the end of (a): "Such growing areas shall be re-established on an annual basis." MOTION: Ms. Imhoff moved that ZTA 95-03 Farm Sales be recommended to the Board of Supervisors for approval as presented by staff with the following changes: --Add to 5.1.35(a): Such growing areas shall be reestablished on an annual basis. --Change the second sentence in 5.1.35(b) to read: Greenhouses shall not be counted as part of the total retail sales area, unless one is designated as the farm sales structure. (The phrase shall not be open to the public, and therefore, is to be deleted.) --Change the percentages in the third and fourth sentences of 5.1.35(b) to be "' 50% (in the third sentence) and 50% (in the fourth sentence). cm (Ms. Imhoff motion did not include a change to wording in the definition as suggested by Mr. Peyton'.) Mr. Dotson seconded the motion. Discussion: Ms. Huckle commended staff for their work on this amendment. However, though she said this was "probably a good motion," she could not support the motion because she felt an agricultural -forestal district is not an appropriate location for a commercial retail store where half the stock would be items not produced on the farm. She said this will be time consuming for the Zoning Department and will compromise agricultural -forestal districts. She said: "There are other farm producers who seem to be doing all right and for the little amount of money that will be realized from the sale of these other items, we would be opening the door to some people who might not be as conscientious as the original applicant. I could support this if all the products were farm produced, though they would not have to have all been produced on the farm where the store is located, because I think that would encourage agriculture." 447- on Etb.4s OU 7 The motion passed (4:2) with Commissioners Blue and Huckle casting the dissenting votes. ZTA 95-04 Farmer's Market - Proposal to amend Section 22.0 Commercial, C-1, and Section 24.0 Highway Commercial, HC, of the Zoning Ordinance, to permit farmer's market by right; and to amend Section 10.0, Rural Areas District, RA, of the Zoning Ordinance, to permit farmers' market by special use permit. Deferred from August 15 Commission Meeting. Ms. Scala presented the staff report. The staff report, and staffs oral presentation, explained changes made to the proposed amendment to address concerns expressed by the Commission at the August 15th meeting. Mr. Dotson asked if it is possible for individuals to lease County property as a possible location, and if, so, would that mean the event would be County sponsored. Ms. McCulley said the County would have to participate in some way (more than just though a lease agreement). Mr. Dotson said: "So with County involvement, it could go on a school site, otherwise not." Mr Cilimberg explained that the possibility of a token lease amount, such as $1, had been discussed. He thought such an arrangement, i.e. "almost a free lease," could qualify as County participation. Mr. Kamptner explained the School Board's policy regarding usage of their property: "A request is made to the Superintendent's Office and they simply allow uses and they have certain fees for the costs, and if it's deemed to be public I don't think there is any cost. I don't think the School Board will likely get into the business of leasing parking lots for a particular event. There may just be on -going granted permission to use a particular parking lot for particular hours." Mr. Dotson asked if such an arrangement would be considered County sponsored. Mr. Kamptner responded: "I think it is a slightly different question that goes back to the level of participation that the County has in the market." Mr. Cilimberg said the schools have a "rate of lease" which applies to private individuals asking for the use of a facility. If the School Board were to give the facility ... (sentence completed by Mr. Dotson) "then it's a public -private partnership." Mr. Cilimberg responded affirmatively. Public comment was invited. Mr. Joseph Harding, who introduced himself as "the regional petitioner" for this request, addressed the Commission. He explained his successful experience with the establishment of farmers' markets in other areas. There being no further public comment, the matter was placed before the Commission. 1/9 En 8-29-95 8 Mr. Dotson said it was hard to argue with this proposal because it is a commercial activity proposed in commercial areas. Referring to comments made by Mr. Harding about musicians at these markets, Mr. Dotson asked if there are controls in Commercial areas which would address issues such as noise, acoustics, music, etc. Ms. McCulley said that at a certain point a musical activity could be deemed to be a public dance hall and would require a special permit by the Board of Supervisors. Other than that, there are new noise regulations which are being proposed. She suggested that this could be addressed in the text of the amendment if the Commission desired. Mr. Dotson said: "If they apply generally in commercial districts, I don't see any reason for special attention." Ms. Huckle pointed out that noise could be a concern if a market were to locate on a school site, such as Albemarle High School, which is surrounded by residential area. Ms. Imhoff said: "However, I would note that (the supplementary regulations) actually wouldn't apply if it was on a school property, because, as staff noted, that would then be considered a part of a public use, and would just be an agreement between the County and the farmers' market. I don't see how these supplementary regulations would be triggered if it was on school property." Ms. Scala said: "I would think that it would be used as a guide, but I don't think they would be required to use them." Addressing the noise issue, Ms. Imhoff pointed out that there are other uses in commercial areas, such as auto sales, which often have promotions using "balloons, banners, and music." Referring to another statement by Mr. Harding about the possible sale of t-shirts as a promotional item, Mr. Dotson said he thought that was appropriate. He pointed out, however, that the definition does not allow the sale of commercially manufactured products. Ms. McCulley addressed this question: "I would say'no' that it does not come within this particular use. In fact it has been my position that a flea market is not currently permitted under the commercial districts, and it is different from general retail sales." Mr. Harding was allowed to comment further. He explained that t-shirts were used for advertising, at an at -cost basis. Only acoustical music was allowed. No electrical, amplified music was ever allowed. He stressed that community participation is essential for the success of a farmers' market. Mr. Blue said: "It seems some (of the Commission) have been scared by the possibility of amplified music and selling of t-shirts. It is not addressed in the proposed amendment and I would suggest that we leave it alone and if the market people decide to advertise with t-shirts and somebody playing a guitar, unless there is a complaint, we don't worry about it." LFIVA 8-29-95 Ms. Imhoff and Mr. Nitchmann expressed agreement. 9 MOTION: Ms. Imhoff moved that ZTA-95-04 Farmers' Market be recommended to the Board of Supervisors for approval as presented by staff. Mr. Nitchmann seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously. ZTA-95-05 Commercial Stables - Proposal to amend Section 10.0, Rural Areas District, RA, of the Zoning Ordinance, to permit commercial stables by right, and to include all necessary supplementary regulations related thereto. Ms. Scala presented the staff report. The staff report, and staffs oral presentation, explained changes made to the proposed amendment to address concerns expressed by the Commission at the August 15th meeting. Ms. Scala explained that the Zoning Administrator would prefer that the definition include a level of intensity, i.e. a certain number of horses or ponies should be set. Ms. Scala said staff suggested "a minimum of 10 horses or ponies, boarded or for hire." (Horses belonging to the owner, which are not for hire, would not be counted in this number.) She explained 10 is the number used by Loudoun County to differentiate between a private and commercial stable. Without a set number, this would be a matter for interpretation by the Zoning Administrator. Ms. Huckle asked if Health Department approval should be included in the Supplementary Regulations. Ms. Scala said she could think of no occasion where Health Department approval would be needed. She noted, however, that Health Department approval is a part of the site plan approval process, and Supplementary Regulation 5.1.3(c) requires a site plan, (unless waived by the Commission). Ms. Huckle asked about lighting. Ms. Scala said lighting will also be addressed through site plan review and there is an Ordinance requirement that lighting not spill over onto adjacent properties. Mr. Cilimberg noted that the Commission has, in the past, attached conditions to waiver approvals which address lighting and other such issues. Ms. Huckle asked if the restriction against "horse show grounds" would also include a rodeo. Ms. McCulley responded: "It would be my opinion that a rodeo is going to fall within the special permit requirement for horse show grounds." She said there is presently no definition of rodeo or horse show grounds in the Ordinance. She said a rodeo would not fall under the exemption. 6-0 8-29-95 10 Mr. Nitchmann asked if entrance requirements would be covered in the site plan approval process. Ms. Scala responded: WDOT is part of the site plan review --so whatever they require." Public comment was invited. Ms. Christy Bollinger addressed the Commission. She said she supported the amendment, "for practical purposes," but she felt parts of the amendment were very nebulous. She thought the definition of commercial stable was unclear and likewise the intention in relation to spectators. When asked how many horses she keeps, Ms. Bollinger pointed out that if there are concerns about the vehicles trips on the road, then the number of owners should be counted rather than the number of horses because some owners have several horses boarded. Mr. Blue asked for the number of horses. Ms. Bollinger said she presently has 12 horses, but the number changes from time to time. She expressed concern about the number 10 which she seemed to understand was a limit to 10 horses (rather than a minimum for the purpose of the definition). She said a commercial stable could not survive financially if limited to 10 boarded horses. Ms. Riz Dolsky (?) addressed the Commission. She expressed concern about the use of pine bark as a riding surface cover [as referred to in Supplementary Reg. 5.1.3(a)]. She said pine bark holds a lot of moisture and can be slippery and dangerous when wet. She pointed out that most riding arenas try to keep dust at a minimum. Addressing the question about spectators, she suggested the following replace 5.1.3(f): "No events soliciting the general public shall be allowed without a special permit." She explained such language would cover rodeos and polo matches. She too expressed concern about the possibility of a 10 horse limitation. She explained: "If you make it 10 horses, that makes horse owners possibly subject to some of the commercial regulations." Mr. Blue explained that the number would not apply to an owner's horses kept on his/her own private property. He said: "It does not mean that everybody in the County who owns more than 10 horses is going to have to (get a zoning clearance for a commercial stable)." She said she supported the idea of the amendment. In response to Mr. Blue's question about possible surface covers, Ms. Dolsky said she has used a "non -dust, blue stone clay." Some facilities use a clay -sand mixture or rubber filings. She did not think it was necessary to require a certain type of cover. Mr. Charles Beagle addressed the Commission. He pointed out that the horse farm industry is a very large part of the agricultural industry in Albemarle County. He hoped the Commission would do all possible to encourage the horse industry. He supported making commercial stables by -right. He agreed that pine bark was not a desirable surface for a riding ring and recommended that the reference to pine bark be deleted. sr/ 8-29-95 11 '44w- Ms. Elaine Beagle expressed concern about the number 10. She suggested that the number be tied to the acreage. [NOTE: Mr. Cilimberg attempted to clarify the number issue. He explained: "Establishing the number is the point at which the commercial stable provision would kick in. Anything below whatever number may be finally established, the operation would not be considered a commercial stable and would be an unregulated use of the land." Mr. Dotson added: "And the regulations that would kick in are these supplemental regulations." Mr. Cilimberg responded: "Yes. It (would be) a by -right use but certain supplementary regulations would have to be met if you had that many horses or beyond." Mr. Blue asked Ms. Beagle: "And you're suggesting that the number should be higher than 10." Ms. Beagle responded: "That's right. It should be higher than 10, like 25 for example (before these regulations would kick in). Ms. Mary Taylor addressed the Commission. Though very supportive of the horse industry, she was opposed to allowing commercial stables by -right. She stressed that commercial stables vary a great deal in terms of the types of riding offered, the number of horses boarded, whether or not minors are involved, number of employees, arrangements for payment, the physical layout of the land and buildings, etc. She was concerned because a by -right situation does not allow for consideration of impact on neighboring properties. She felt the best way to allow this use is through the special permit system, which will allow examination of the particularities of a proposal and regulate them on a case -by -case basis. She had researched the 7 commercial stable applications approved by the Board of Supervisors and had found several conditions to have been a common factor in all approvals. She thought these conditions, in addition to a 100-foot setback and screening requirement, should be added to the Ordinance. She listed those conditions: --Planning Commission approval of site plan. --Health Department approval in accordance with requirements for commercial use. --Fences maintained at all times. --VDOT approval of commercial entrance. --All riding surfaces to be covered with a material to prevent dust. --Any grading plan to be reviewed by the Watershed Management Official in addition to review by the County Engineer. --Maintain screening from adjacent properties. --No facilities for sale of goods to the public. --No commercial activity except that associated with the stable. Ms. Sue Highboard, a resident of Mechunk Acres, addressed the Commission. She described the problems, primarily related to private road usage, the residents of Mechunk Acres have experienced as a result of the stable business operated by Ms. Bollinger. She was opposed to commercial stables being made a by -right use. She felt the Commission should consider the issue of the status of the road which may serve as the access for a commercial stable. She expressed the belief that Ms. Bollinger has 5z 8-29-95 12 always operated a commercial stable, even though the present and previous Zoning Administrators have said that she cannot do so without a special use permit. (Ms. Hubbard was accompanied by several other neighbors who shared her opposition to the proposed amendment.) Ms. Bollinger again addressed the Commission and described problems which have been encountered with the road maintenance agreement. Mr. Blue advised her that this was a private issue which could not be addressed by the Commission. Ms. Bollinger said the point she wished to make is that it is for reasons such as this that commercial stables should be made a by -right use in the rural areas. There being no further public comment, the matter was placed before the Commission. Ms. Imhoff asked staff to refresh her memory as to Faquier County's regulations for commercial stables. Ms. Scala said Faquier allows them by -right in the RA district, and by special permit in the Rural Conservation District, Rural Residential 2 (2-acre lots), the Village district, and the R-1 district. Mr. Blue asked about the status of commercial stables presently in the County. Ms. McCulley said they are allowed by special permit, but the definition has been "problematic" as it now stands. Mr. Nitchmann asked: "So the solution proposed is to make it by -right, rather than to clean up the Zoning Ordinance?" Ms. McCulley responded: "I think there are two solutions --either clarify the definition so there is a distinction as to at what point it goes from being a private use of the land to a commercial operation, or decide, as a policy point of view, that it should be made by right. Either way, I would ask that you clarify the definition for commercial stable." Ms. Huckle asked about setback requirements. Ms. McCulley responded: "A primary structure setback is 75 feet from an external public road and 25 feet from an internal public or private road. An outdoor riding ring itself is not treated as a structure and would not have any setback at all. But anything that involves a structure like a stable is considered an accessory building and can have a setback as little as 6 feet to a side or rear property line." Ms. Huckle asked: "And that would include an indoor riding ring?" Ms. McCulley replied: "That's right, without this requirement." Ms. McCulley explained that if this amendment is passed the setback from the neighboring property will be 25 feet if on a private road, or 75 feet if on a public road. Ms. Scala added: "The way we have it written, the farm -type structures, the stable building and the indoor riding ring would meet the primary setbacks--75 feet front, 25 feet side and 35 feet rear. But the outdoor uses, such as the outdoor riding ring and the parking area, we have said they should be at least 50 feet from any adjoining property." Ms. Scala said this is greater s�1 8-29-95 13 than what is required currently for a barn, which is 6 feet because it is considered an accessory structure. Acknowledging that it is easy to get caught up in neighbor conflicts, Ms. Imhoff said she wanted to remind the Commission of the bigger picture. She said: "What we're talking abpir is what uses do we do by -right in the rural area. You can do stock yards; you can have poultry farms; you can have hog farms and there are absolutely no restrictions whatsoever. So when we're looking at horse operations I want all of us to keep that in mind. It seems to me that we are penalizing and carefully scrutinizing one part of the agricultural industry and there are a whole lot of other things going one. I think Mr. Beagle's comments about farming being a dusty business are very true. When people are moving their cattle, haying their fields, discing up, spreading manure, that's what happens when you live in a rural area. We keep saying that we want agricultural and forestal industries in our rural areas and that they are the primary industry of our rural areas. And we are trying to discourage residential development in rural areas. So let's do what we can to make sure that we can be supportive of this kind of use." Mr. Nitchmann pointed out that a lot of the activities mentioned by Ms. Imhoff are seasonal in nature and they will not generate as much traffic as a commercial stable can generate. Ms. Imhoff agreed that traffic and the road is an issue, but she thought supplementary regulation (e) addressed the concerns about road usage. She added that the site plan process will require that VDOT be involved if it is a public road. She noted, however, that there are other agricultural uses, particularly those involving livestock, were there is a lot of in and out traffic. Mr. Nitchmann asked if the conditions listed by Ms. Taylor would be covered under the site plan review process. Ms. Scala said that the Health Department and VDOT are a part of the process and adjacent owners are notified of site plans. Mr. Cilimberg added that grading will be covered by the Engineering Department and the Watershed Management Official will be involved if the site is in the watershed. Mr. Nitchmann thought the main question is at what point (what number of horses) the commercial stable designation will apply. Mr. Nitchmann questioned why this matter was brought to the Commission. He said he thought it should have been addressed by fixing the zoning requirements. Pointing out that there have only been 8 requests in 25 years, he questioned whether there was a need for this amendment. He acknowledged, however, that the horse industry is important in this community and that there should probably be some type of by -right activity. But he was not sure what the starting level for the activity should be (i.e. the number of horses). 6c/ 8-29-95 14 Ms. Huckle said she was sure that were a lot more than 8 commercial stable operations in the County. Mr. Nitchmann responded: "If that's the case, then I 'm surprised that this room is not filled up with people that own stables, if there are so many of them (in the county)." He noted that of those present, there was an almost equal mix of people who are opposed and people who are supportive. Regarding the riding surface material, Mr. Nitchmann suggested that Section 5.1.3(a) be changed to read: "Riding rings and riding surfaces shall be maintained so as to minimize dust and erosion." Mr. Dotson compared this amendment to the one for farm sales. He said in that case 600 feet is allowed by right and more than that, 1,500 feet, requires a special permit. He said this amendment for commercial stables seems to be a request for "open season" on commercial stables. He said: "I think we need to clarify the definition. I'm not sure whether it's 10 or not, but that would be a number. Then maintain the special permit for commercial stables because it seems to me they do raise some issues that ought to be looked at. I think that would be even-handed with the way we dealt with farm sales. There is a certain size you can have by right --it's pretty small. Beyond that, we need to take at look at it." Mr. Blue said he tended to agree with Mr. Dotson but he wondered what type of action such an approach would require. He said: "We have before us ZTA 95-05 which is to make commercial stables by -right, and what you're suggesting is to clean up the definition of it, but not allow them by right." Mr. Dotson added: "Clean up the definition and have the supplementary regulations." Mr. Blue asked Mr. Kamptner if the Commission could take such an action. Mr. Cilimberg summarized the action being contemplated by Mr. Dotson: "It is by special permit currently, and was advertised to become by -right. Now you are raising the issue of allowing it to become by -right, but only up to a certain level, which is more restrictive than what was advertised. I know that in a Zoning Map Amendment, if we propose an action that is more restrictive than what was advertised, we have to re - advertise. I don't know about Zoning Text Amendments." Mr. Dotson said: "This would be less restrictive than it currently is, but more restrictive than the advertised proposal." Mr. Cilimberg responded: "Right. The advertisement is the key." Mr. Kamptner commented: "You are considering a revision that would be more restrictive. It's a text change and doesn't pertain to a specific piece of property. It would have general application throughout the County wherever it might apply. You can make your recommendation based on the notice that has already been provided." sl 8-29-95 15 Ms. Imhoff asked counsel: "I think that some argument could be made that the State's Right -To -Farm Law, which talks about production agriculture, clearly covers poultry, clearly covers hog farms, so subsequently all those things are now by -right. The argument may be made that it could cover horse farms of certain scales. Do you know of anybody who has questioned that or whether commercial stables would fall under the Right -To -Farm legislation?" Ms. McCulley said it was the County Attorney's opinion that this will not fall within that language because it is not a production operation. Mr. Nitchmann suggested that the recommendation be that commercial stables be permitted by -right, up to 5 horses, and then the applicant could make the argument before the Board as to the number. Along with that, those parts of the Zoning Ordinance which are currently causing the problem could be considered. He thought if hog farms have been approved as by -right, then it is only a matter of time until horse farms will be also. Mr. Dotson pointed out that this is not really a horse production operation. Rather, it is an activity which is more commercial, it is more concentrated, it is more frequent, it involves more traffic, and it involves more urban types of improvements. lftw To achieve Mr. Dotson's recommended approach, Mr. Blue suggested that this ZTA could be denied, which would result in the status of commercial stables remaining as it is presently, until someone comes up with a different proposal. He pointed out that presently it is by special permit, but there is apparently something lacking in the definition, which could be corrected later. MOTION: Mr. Dotson moved that ZTA 95-05 be recommended to the Board of Supervisors for approval as proposed by staff, but with the following changes: --Insert the number ten (10) in the definition. --Do not allow commercial stables as a by -right use in the Rural Areas District. --Retain (as it presently exists) commercial stables as a use by special permit in the Rural Areas District. --Add to Supplementary Regulations Section 5.1.3 Commercial Stables. --Delete from Supplementary Regulation 5.1.3(a), the phrase "such as pine bark." Mr. Dotson felt this would improve the definition, would clarify for small operations (fewer than 10 horses) that a special permit is not needed, and for larger operations, whatever their present status, this now sets the rules. Mr. Nitchmann seconded the motion. s4 8-29-95 16 Mr. Nitchmann asked Ms. McCulley if she felt it would still be necessary, to clarify further other stipulations related to commercial stables in the Zoning Ordinance. Ms. McCulley thought this action would make the situation better, but it still could be clearer. Mr. Nitchmann said: "So what you think is we probably need to review the zoning requirements for commercial stables." (Ms. McCulley responded affirmatively by nodding her head.) Mr. Blue said he thought staff had said the addition of a number to the definition would clear up the problems Ms. McCulley has had in the past. Ms. McCulley said: "I'm still going to have to deal with which cases are the commercial stables that will then require a special permit." Mr. Blue responded: "Anything that is 10 or more horses." [Though Ms. Imhoff added "...that are being boarded," Mr. Nitchmann said the motion had not made that distinction. Ms. Imhoff was under the impression Mr. Dotson's motion had intended that the number apply to horses which are boarded. Mr. Dotson later confirmed that his motion had meant 10 boarded horses.] Ms. McCulley said: "As the staff recommended, there would not need to be any distinction. Any case would be by - right." Mr. Blue said: "Any case would be by -right, fewer than 10, but anything more than 10, these supplemental regulations would apply, with a special use permit, as proposed by Mr. Dotson. The question is, would that help you enough?" Mr. Nitchmann interjected: "My question is, do you still want us to take a look at the requirements for zoning of commercial stables, regardless of what we do here tonight? Yes or no." Ms. McCulley responded: "Yes, it needs further clarification." Mr. Dotson withdrew his motion. Mr. Nitchmann withdrew his second to the motion. MOTION: Mr. Dotson moved that ZTA 95-05 be denied. There was no second to this motion. ALTERNATIVE MOTION: Ms. Imhoff moved that ZTA 95-05 for Commercial Stables be deferred to September 19, 1995, with the direction to staff that "there are two thoughts on this --one to keep it by special permit and clean up the definition and make sure that supplementary regulations meet some of the concerns raised by Commissioners Dotson and Nitchmann, and the other that I (Commissioner Imhoff) still believe this should be a use by -right but with supplementary regulations." Mr. Nitchmann seconded the motion. Discussion: Ms. Huckle suggested that staff include some of the standards read by Ms. Taylor. Ms. Scala questioned why these would be needed if they are already covered by site plan approval. 6�?" 8-29-95 17 The motion passed unanimously. Ms. Vaughan left the meeting at 9:30 p.m. Chisholm Site Plan Waiver Request - Request to locate a fourth dwelling unit on approximately 488.20 acres, described as Tax Map 31, parcel 23. Mr. Cilimberg gave a brief staff report. He explained the request is to establish a mobile home in association with the wayside stand which already exists on the property. He said the applicant has verified that "he can do the lots that need to go with the residences, so a site plan, in (staffs) opinion, is not necessary." Staff was recommending approval of the request subject to one condition. Mr. Cilimberg confirmed that the fact that the residence to be established is a mobile home has no bearing on the request. The applicant was represented by Mr. Hunter Davidson. He offered no additional comment. There being no public comment, the matter was placed before the Commission. MOTION: Ms. Imhoff moved, seconded by Ms. Huckle, that the Chisholm Site Plan Waiver Request be approved subject to the following condition: 1. Provide a gate or cable across the road to control access between the nursery and the area used by Haley, Chisholm and Morris, Inc. to store equipment. The motion passed unanimously. Work Session (Continuation of 5:15 session) Road Projects Mr. Benish briefly described, and pointed out on a map, the major road projects identified in the Land Use Plan and in the Six -Year Primary and Secondary Plan priority list. There being no further business, the meeting adjourned at 10:00 p.m. 4-81 8-29-95 . 1 18 N. V. Wayne)Cilimberg, MA 5:15 Work Session 8/29195 WORK SESSION Albemarle County Planning Commission 5:15 Atigust 29, 1995 Comprehensive Plan Transportation Comments included: [NOTE: The recording equipment was started after the meeting had begun. Representatives of Forest Lakes and Hollymead were speaking.] Representatives of the Forest Lakes (John MacDonald) and Hollymead (Denise Kirschner) neighborhoods presented a report to the Commission which had been compiled by committees representing Forest Lakes and Hollymead. The report described scenarios which supported the final conclusion, i.e. that the majority of residents 'object to the contention that always secondary connectors are positive" (because) a reduction in traffic on the primary roads is achieved at the expense of the quality of life in the effected neighborhoods. The speakers said that the residents of both neighborhoods are opposed to the neighborhoods being connected by internal roads. Ms. Kirschner said the Hollymead residents are primarily concerned about traffic that will use Powell Creek, which will pass in front of the school, thereby creating a very dangerous situation for hundreds of school children. The Forest Lakes representative said Forest Lakes residents are more concerned about the additional traffic that will be generated by the "commercial magnet" area. Ms. Kirschner distributed a map showing a possible layout for a future parallel service road which would keep access roads off the primary roads. She felt it is important to plan for these service roads now, before further development makes them impossible. Mr. Dotson thought the plan presented by Ms. Kirschner was a good one because it gives equal attention to land use and transportation. He suggested that the map be displayed as "one idea" during the county -wide public meetings to take place at the end of the month. (At the end of the meeting, Mr. Cilimberg said there is no argument that the advantages of neighborhood connections must be balanced against the effects, nor is there any argument that the concept of multiple service roads is an ideal solution. However, it is a concept that is not always achievable because of the way land use has actually occurred, the way ownership occurs, the costs involved, and the existence of physical barriers (e.g. rivers, cemeteries, etc.) 5:15 Work Session 8/29/95 2 Ms. Imhoff asked if VDOT could verify some of the figures quoted by the Forest Lakes representative, particularly that 40% of the traffic will be generated by the "commercial magnet" area. Mr. Benish led a discussion of the Transportation section of the Land Use Plan. Issues raised by the Commission and suggested changes included the following: --Mr. Dotson said he was satisfied with the principles stated in the CATS study. He suggested that they could be paraphrased and used in the Transportation section. --Ms. Imhoff wondered if the "iced tea" (ISTEA) projects should be mentioned on pages 2 and 3. --Mr. Dotson questioned whether the MPO should be identified as the main "transportation planning body" as suggested by staff. Ms. Imhoff asked if perhaps he meant that the language should be softened somewhat, e.g. "...the MPO should take a leading role in..., or "...in partnership with." Mr. Dotson said he was just trying to figure out the county's role. Mr. Blue pointed out that MPO gives the county more of a participation role, so that VDOT does not call all the shots as it did previously. Referring to the section on page 3 which talks about "our efforts --the Comp Plan, the Six -Year Primary and Secondary Plan, etc.", Mr. Dotson said: "Maybe when you re- formulate this you could repeat that in some fashion so it appears in bold someplace, so that it is clear that we have a significant role, not just a descriptive portion." --Mr. Blue said he had underlined the last sentence at the top of page 5. He explained: "We seem to think of the MPO, and even categorize it here, as being the lead agency (but), for better or worse, VDOT is the one building, maintaining and financing the roads." Mr. Cilimberg suggested it could be made clearer that, in the urbanized area not a single VDOT-funded project can be built without the MPO approving the Transportation Improvement Program." Mr. Blue added: "The MPO can plan and approve all it wants and not a single one will be built unless VDOT funds it." Ms. Imhoff said a map showing the MPO area would be helpful. She pointed out there is a lot of area in the county which is not in the MPO, and VDOT is ultimately responsible for those areas. (Mr. Benish said the map had been omitted in error.) --Mr. Blue suggested that the words be spelled out for the acronyms MINUTP and COMSIS on page 5. (Mr. Cilimberg later explained that COMSIS is the name of a company.) --Referring to public transit planning, Ms. Imhoff suggested that the private sector plan adopted by the MPO several years ago, which describes how the private sector will participate, be referenced by saying "For further information, this document is available from the MPO." She said the fact that the document was "in all caps" had given her the impression that it was an adopted document. --Referring to a strategy on page 5, Mr. Dotson suggested the following addition: "Future development and/or redevelopment of these existing areas should take into account the traffic handling capacity of its major corridors." He explained: "You look at what you can do, based on what you've got; you look at how much you can expand it; 61 5:15 Work Session 8/29/95 3 you balance and make tradeoffs between transportation and land use. This just strikes me as too one-way." Ms. Imhoff and Ms. Huckle supported this suggestion. Ms. Huckle said she hoped there will be no future situations like that which currently exists at Hollymead and Forest Lakes. --Mr. Dotson felt the word redevelopment should be used each time the word development is used. --Ms. Imhoff felt strategies 6 and 7 should be changed to "mesh with one another." --Ms. Imhoff thought the role of the MINUTP should be made clearer. She wondered if there should be another paragraph which says "On some development projects individual transportation studies are sometimes required." --Mr. Dotson asked if the Commission will have an opportunity to see the traffic consequences of the proposed growth area expansion prior to final adoption of the Land Use Plan. Mr. Benish thought the traffic model was going to be available in time, though he was not certain. Ms. Imhoff suggested that at least the two major areas proposed for expansion (north and south) could be looked at first, even if the all the information is not available in time. Mr. Dotson thought it would be difficult to act, 'one way or the other," without having a lot more traffic information. Mr. Blue disagreed. Though he agreed it would be preferable to have the traffic analysis, he pointed out that the proposal to expand the northern growth area had not been based on the question of how it will be served with utilities. That was to be left to the Service Authority. He felt this was the same situation. He explained: "We realize that when we are designating this area as growth area there are going to have to be some transportation effects and, most likely, some transportation improvements. But whether we are going to be able to look at it in more specifics ... I view that as somewhat parallel to what we did with utilities and we did not come up with a specific answer." Ms. Imhoff thought the transportation issue was somewhat different because roads use a lot more land area. --Ms. Imhoff said she liked the Design Standards section very much. --Ms. Huckle asked if it might be possible for businesses who provide transportation pools for their employees to receive tax breaks. --In an attempt to reduce traffic generation, Ms. Imhoff said some localities have used strategies such as reducing the number of required parking spaces. She suggested this might be an additional strategy to be considered for this Transportation section. --Referring to traffic reduction strategies, Mr. Dotson wondered if there should be another section dealing with "demand reduction" which would "talk about other things we could do in how we arrange our land uses that would have the net effect of reducing demand." --Recalling statements made at previous meetings by the development community that transportation standards raise the cost of housing, Mr. Dotson suggested a statement "that there is a connection to housing costs and an action item would be to (study that issue)." 5:15 Work Session 8/29/95 4 --Mr. Dotson suggested a statement be added saying the County supports the "rails -to -trails" concept." --Mr. Dotson thought there should be a reference to the fact that sidewalks may be required in some developments. Mr. Cilimberg pointed out that if sidewalks are in a public right of way, unless they are within a certain distance or a school or commercial use, VDOT will not maintain them. They must be maintained through a contract with VDOT and either a homeowner's association or the County, and the County has no provisions, at this time, for such maintenance. --Ms. Huckle suggested that bicycle riding regulations recently recommended by the PAC committee should be posted in bike shops once the County has endorsed them. --Ms. Imhoff wondered if the Rivanna Greenway should be mentioned in the Transportation section. She noted that it is another pathway system which is being developed which could be an alternative for pedestrian access. --Ms. Huckle asked if any progress has been made on the upgrading of the AMTRAK station. She pointed out that this is an entryway into the area, the same as the entrance corridors and the airport. The work session ended at 6:50 p.m. 43