HomeMy WebLinkAboutSP200400016 Review Comments Special Use Permit 2004-08-12 Page 1 of 1
"' "Elaine Echols
From: Elaine Echols
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 3 03 PM
To: Don Franco
Cc: 'LMeistrell@thekesslergroup.com'
Subject: Forest Lakes N and S Clubs
Hi Don -- here is the last email, I think.
Hopefully, you received the emails from John Kitzmann. My goal is to have a hard number as
the limit for numbers of new units that can use the clubs. It should be a number you can both
agree to. Zoning and Co. Atty have both said, "no approximates".
Right now, this project has been deferred to October. Hopefully, y'all can agree on something
in September.
If you are able to conclude with a number for the October meeting, please provide that
information no later than September 20, if the only change to the conditions reviewed by the
Planning Commission is the # of lots. If you want to ask for something different in the
conditions, please provide that information no later than September 8.
Thanks.
Elaine
Elaine K. Echols,AICP, Principal Planner
Albemarle County Dept. of Planning and Community Development
401 McIntire Road
Charlottesville,VA 22902
434/296-5823 x 3252
www.albernarle.org
8/12/2004
Page l of 2
Elaine Echols Ckj(VIAid
From: Ella Carey
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 10:55 AM
To: Elaine Echols
Subject: RE Forest Lakes North and South Swim and Tennis Clubs
I just need to withdraw the advertisement. Is this for both of the sps
From: Elaine Echols
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 10:43 AM
To: Ella Carey; Wayne Cilimberg
Subject: FW: Forest Lakes North and South Swim and Tennis Clubs
what do I need to do to make this indefinite deferral happen?
From: DFranco@thekesslergroup.com [mailto:DFranco@thekesslergroup.com]
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 10:25 AM
To: EECHOLS@albemarle.org
Cc:jhk@dklawyers.com; gmcgee@mcguirewoods.com
Subject: RE: Forest Lakes North and South Swim and Tennis Clubs
Elaine:
I spoke with John Kitzmann. We are in agreement that the SP should be deferred while several issues
between FLA and FLCA are resolved. Therefore, on behalf of FLCA, I am asking you to defer the SP. I will
contact you in the near future to establish a new date for the action.
Don
Original Message
From: Elaine Echols [mailto:EECHOLS@albemarle.org]
Sent: Friday, July 23, 2004 5:38 PM
To: 'jhk@dklawyers.com'; Don Franco; Don Franco (E-mail)
Subject: Forest Lakes North and South Swim and Tennis Clubs
Dear Mr. Kitzmann and Mr. Franco,
At the Planning Commission meeting on Tuesday, July 13, the Planning Commission
asked that the staff contact the Community Association and Forest Lakes Association to
make sure that the following condition is acceptable to both entities.
This is the language that the Commission approved as a condition for both special use
permits:
The use, as approved, shall be limited to the residents and guests of the following
developments: Forest Lakes South, Springridge, Pine Ridge, Lanford Hills,
Steeplechase, Amberfield, Cove Pointe, Edgewater, Gateway, Worthcrossing, Chelsea,
7/79/7004
Page 2 of 2
Arbor Lake, Waterford, Watercrest, Copperknoll, Echo Ridge, Ridgefield, Poplar Ridge,
Heather Glen, Whispering Woods, Timberwood, Timber Pointe and Autumn Woods and
any future contiguous developments not exceeding approximately 125 dwelling units
whose use of the facilities is permitted by the owner
It is important that both parties agree on acceptable language in order for this item to
proceed to the Board of Supervisor's August 4 meeting.
Margaret Doherty, the planner who last worked on this project, said that she believed this
language was acceptable to both parties; however, I am asking you to please review it
and contact me as soon as possible if the language is not acceptable.
Thank you.
Elaine Echols
Principal Planner
Albemarle County Planning Dept.
Elaine K. Echols,AICP, Principal Planner
Albemarle County Dept. of Planning and Community Development
401 McIntire Road
Charlottesville,VA 22902
434/296-5823 x 3252
www.albemarle.org
7/29/2004
Page 1 of 3
Elaine Echols
From: John H. Kitzmann [jhk@dklawyers.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 1:59 PM
To: Elaine Echols
Cc: Gary McGee; Don Franco
Subject: Re: Forest Lakes
Elaine:
Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. I've been in court. Since I wrote that email that you want to
forward, I've talked to Don and Gary McGee regarding the situation. I've told Don and Gary that the
Forest Lakes Community Association is getting tax advice right now on some issues regarding how the
two properties are going to be transferred. My understanding is that Don and Gary want to wait until
that tax advice comes through and FLCA and FLA figure out how the transfer of the properties is going
to be structured before any final decisions on zoning are made. Our accountant should be getting back
to me in the next few days, at which point I'm going to call Gary and Don and see what we can work
out. I've copied this email to both Don and Gary.
Best regards,
John Kitzmann
John H. Kitzmann, Esq.
DAVIDSON & KITZMANN, PLC
211 East High Street
Charlottesville, Virginia 22902
Tel.: (434) 972-9600
Fax: (434) 220-0011
Email:jhk�dklawyers.com
Web: www.dklawyers.com
Original Message
From: Elaine Echols
To: jhk@dklawyers.com'
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 1:40 PM
Subject: RE: Forest Lakes
I don't know if you received this email, but, I'd like to forward your current position to
Don Franco with Forest Lakes Associates, unless you've been in touch with him since
last Friday.
I have talked to our County Attorney and he believes that we need a solid, not an
approximate number. So, whatever number you and Forest Lakes Associates
ultimately arrive at will be the ceiling for number of units to be served.
Please let me know as soon as you can. I will be out of the office next week.
Elaine Echols
8/27/2004
Page 2 of 3
From: Elaine Echols
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 2:04 PM
To: 'jhk@dklawyers.com'
Subject: FW: Forest Lakes
John -- do you mind if I send this email to Don Franco?
From: John H. Kitzmann [mailto:jhk@dklawyers.com]
Sent: Friday, July 30, 2004 12:53 PM
To: Elaine Echols
Cc: Barb Fehse
Subject: Forest Lakes
Elaine:
Sorry for the delay in getting back to you on your phone message. The FLCA has
authorized me to assist them throughout the process of getting the two swim clubs
transferred from Forest Lakes Associates (FLA)to FLCA. Unfortunately, my main
contact with the Board was not previously through the president, but through a Board
member. My understanding at that time was that the Board was agreeable to the special
use permit as currently written. After speaking with the president, I need to amend my
position and clarify that the Board wishes to investigate the potential impact of the
proposed special use permit on both communities before putting forth an official
position on the special use permit.
My understanding of the wishes of the FLCA and the FLA are as follows:
1. FLA wants to transfer the two swim clubs to FLCA on December 15th
2. FLA wants to ensure that its new development of approximately 118 dwelling units
adjacent to Forest Lakes South will have the use of one or both swim clubs
3. FLA wants to obtain a special use permit to allow residents of Forest Lakes North to
use the South club and vice versa.
4. As to the addition of 118 units, FLCA wants to look at the current capacity of the
clubs to ensure that it can handle an additional 300+ members (assuming 2.5 persons
multiplied by 118 units). I have to check on the current membership of the South club.
I think the combined membership of both clubs is 635 so adding 300+ members would
be a 50% increase.
5. As to North residents using the South club and vice versa, FLCA thinks it is true
that some members of Forest Lakes North use both the North and South swim club and
some members of Forest Lakes South use both the South and North club. However,
beyond anecdotal evidence, I don't think anyone knows how prevalent this behavior is.
I, for example, live in Forest Lakes North, but did not know until I became involved in
this process, that I could use the Forest Lakes South club if I wanted to. Many members
may not know that they can use either club, and many members may accordingly not
currently use both clubs. We just don't know. The two clubs are different (the South
club being smaller). I'm not confident that the Forest Lakes South club (being much
smaller) could handle it if all Forest Lakes North members (as well as the 118 additional
8/27/2004
Page 3 of 3
units) decided to use the South club. I will try to obtain some statistics from FLA and
from FLCA on how much cross-use is going on and if either swim club has a number of
person limit on its capacity. Until I get that information, the Board wants to hold off
giving its approval of the proposed special use permit.
Please let me know your thoughts.
Best regards,
John Kitzmann
John H. Kitzmann, Esq.
DAVIDSON & KITZMANN, PLC
211 East High Street
Charlottesville, Virginia 22902
Tel.: (434) 972-9600
Fax: (434) 220-0011
Email:jhk@dklawy_ers.com
Web: www.dklawyers.com
8/27/2004
Page 1 of 2
Elaine Echols
From: Elaine Echols
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 11.41 AM
To: Greg Kamptner
Cc: Jan Sprinkle
Subject: RE: Forest Lakes
Thanks. We will get a hard number that both parties can agree to.
We actually do care who uses the facilities. The facilities were originally built for these
2 neighborhoods and rely in small part on the foot-traffic to the facilities and in large
part on the neighborhood streets for access.
If the facility is open to the general public, transportation impacts will occur that must
be analyzed. So far, they have not asked us to do this analysis.
The purpose of the special use permit is to legitimize the cross-use by two
neighborhoods of facilities built for these two neighborhoods and for the future use of
125 more units adjacent to these two neighborhoods. That is why the condition is
important.
Thanks again.
Elaine
From: Greg Kamptner
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 11:36 AM
To: Elaine Echols
Subject: RE: Forest Lakes
I'm assuming that Zoning will determine that"approximately 125" is unenforceable, so the simple solution
would be to delete "approximately." However, I think the approach suggested by Jo's motion ("Ms. Higgins
amended the motion to say that it shall be in the approximate range of 125 units."-- page 8 of the July 13,
2004 PC minutes) and adopted by the PC is that staff should consult with the applicant and the HOA and
determine what the appropriate, specific number should be, and that specific number should be in the
approximate range of 125.
Note also in my July 13, 2004 email to Margaret D, I said the following. "Given that the use is allowed by
SP, does the County care who actually uses the facilities'? The scope of the use would be controlled by
the sizes of the lots, the buildings and the available parking."
Greg Kamptner
Assistant County Attorney
County of Albemarle
gkamptne@abemarle org
Notice: This email may contain attorney-client privileged information, privileged work product, or
other confidential information. It is intended only for the designated recipient. If you receive this
message and are not the designated recipient,you are requested to delete this message
8/11/2004
Page 2 of 2
immediately and notify me that you received this email by mistake. Thank you.
From: Elaine Echols
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 10:38 AM
To: Greg Kamptner
Subject: FW: stupid stuff
Any chance you have gotten to this yet?
From: Elaine Echols
Sent: Friday, July 30, 2004 1:37 PM
To: Greg Kamptner
Subject: stupid stuff
Hi Greg --
This is stupid stuff but has to be done. I think the conditions are getting back on track for
Forest Lakes clubhouses, although it has been deferred for now. Assuming the condition
as a whole doesn't change, I don't think we can enforce and "approximately 125"
condition. Any thoughts? I think it has to be a discrete number but the PC didn't want it
to be. I'd like to recommend it just be 125 but somehow make sure that we didn't neglect
to tell the PC that the "approximate" condition wouldn't work.
If you can think of how to rewrite that part of the condition such that the PC's intention is
included, could you let me know.
Thanks.
Elaine
Elaine K. Echols,AICP, Principal Planner
Albemarle County Dept. of Planning and Community Development
401 McIntire Road
Charlottesville,VA 22902
434/296-5823 x 3252
vsv.albemarle.org
8/11/2004
THE
KESSLER
GROUPthekesslergroup.com
July 2,2004
Ms. Margaret Doherty
Albemarle County Department of Planning&Community Development
401 McIntire Road, Room 218
Charlottesville,VA 22902-4596
RE: SP 2004-00017 Forest Lakes South Swim and Tennis Club
SP 2004-00016 Forest Lakes North Swim and Tennis Club
Dear Ms. Doherty,
Thank you for your initial review comments on the referenced application submitted April 19,2004. As
required,this letter provides a written response to your comments as outlined in your facsimile dated
May 19,2004.
Planning Department Comments:
These are existing facilities, approved as an accessory uses to the Forest Lakes North and Forest Lakes
South. The special permits will allow both facilities to be used by the members of Forest Lakes North,
Forest Lakes South, Spring Ridge, Lanford Hills, Pineridge and future contiguous development by Forest
Lakes Associates. These comments may be revised to include provisions for parking.
These facilities are subject to the supplemental regulations of 5.1.16.
The existing facilities at the Forest Lakes South and Forest Lakes North Swim and Tennis Clubs satisfy the
requirements as outlined in sections 5.1.16a and 5.1.16b. Included with this letter are the site plans for
Forest Lakes South,dated January 4, 1996,and Forest Lakes North,dated May 4, 1989. We would like to
include a provision for concessions, section 5.1.16e,as part the special use permits for both Forest Lakes
South and Forest Lakes North.
Upon the advice of our attorney,we are requesting to revise the language above from the existing"and
future contiguous development by Forest lakes Associates"to"and future development subject to the
Forest Lakes Covenants and Restrictions." Additionally,we would like to refer to the Pineridge
neighborhood instead as TMP 46.26F.
We have not received any comments including provisions for parking.
Thank you for comments and review. Please contact me with any questions or concerns.
Sincerely,
Lori Meistrell
cc. Don Franco
P.O. Box 5207, Charlottesville, Va 22905 (434) 979-9500 FAX (434) 979-8055 tkg@thekesslergroup corn
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ALBEMARLE COUNTY
Department of Planning and Community Development
401 McIntire Road
Charlottesville,VA 22902
(804)296-5823 x3250
Fax (804)972-4012
FACSIMILE TRANSMITTAL SHEET
TO FROM
Lori Mestrell Margaret Doherty
COMPANY DATE
Forest Lakes Associates 5/19/2004
FAX NUMBER TOTAL NO.OF PAGES INCLUDING COVER.
979-805514 ' ice
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UD6L?Y"tk.
SP-2004-016
Forest Lakes North
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These are existing facilities, approved as an accessory uses to the Forest Lakes North and
Forest Lakes South. The special permits will allow both facilities to be used by the members of
Forest Lakes North, Forest Lakes South, Springridge, Lanford Hills, Pineridge and future
contiguous development by Forest Lakes Associates.These comments may be revised to include
provisions for parking.
These facilities are subject to the supplemental regulations of 5.1.16 which are included for you
use.
5.1.16 SWIMMING,GOLF,TENNIS CLUBS
Each swimming,golf or tennis club shall be subject to the following:
a.The swimming pool,including the apron,filtering and pumping equipment, and any
buildings,shall be at least seventy-five(75)feet from the nearest property line and at least one
hundred twenty-five(125)feet from any existing dwelling on an adjoining property,except
that,where the lot upon which it is located abuts land in a commercial or industrial district,
the pool may be constructed no less than twenty-five(25)feet from the nearest property line
of such land in a commercial or industrial district;
b.When the lot on which any such pool is located abuts the rear or side line of,or is across the
street from,any residential district,a substantial, sightly wall, fence, or shrubbery shall be
erected or planted, so as to screen effectively said pool from view from the nearest property in
such residential district;
c. (Repealed 6-14-00)
d.The board of supervisors may,for the protection of the health,safety,morals and general
welfare of the community,require such additional conditions as it deems necessary, including
but not limited to provisions for additional fencing and/or planting or other landscaping,
additional setback from property lines,additional parking space, location and arrangement of
lighting, and other reasonable requirements;
e.Provision for concessions for the serving of food,refreshments or entertainment for club
members and guests may be permitted under special use permit procedures.
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